However, she's still willing to comply. Thus the arrival of an unexpected matchmaker when Lily is so young builds tension, as everyone wonders what could possibly be different about Lily. LitCharts Teacher Editions. The experience of foot binding which is extreme physical violence is also traumatic. This suggests that while others may profit from a woman's body, she too can sometimes use her own body as “currency” in this system of objectification. Snow Flower and the Secret Fan is a brilliantly realistic journey back to an era of Chinese history that is as deeply moving as it is sorrowful. Remember that the pain of foot binding is supposed to prepare a girl to withstand a hard life as an adult woman. Snow Flower and the Secret Fan, Lisa See. Snow Flower and the Secret Fan is a story of two extraordinary women surviving in a time of strict rules and ancient customs.. The fried cubes of taro are then coated in melted sugar. ... How do the women in Snow Flower and the Secret Fan defy the stereotypical message that women are weak and worthless? Classic Catalog | Contact Us; Search Limit Snow Flower and the Secret Fan Symbols & Motifs. Notice that Third Sister dies in pain, and that Lily ties this specifically to the fact that she and Beautiful Moon don't know the proper words to comfort her. The first one we are introduced to is Lily's mother. 119) This quote is really important because it describes Lily and Snow flower's relationship. The exotica, fetishism and soap opera in Lisa See's novel of 19th-century China, "Snow Flower and the Secret Fan… Lily is still outside running, but Mama has already begun making bindings and shoes. Yes, foot binding too. With the period detail and deep resonance of Memoirs of a Geisha, this lyrical and emotionally charged novel delves into one of the most mysterious of human relationships: femalefriendship. Foot binding is certainly an act of violence, but it, as well as these beatings from Mama, is described as being helpful and stemming from love. Even as a child, Lily is very concerned about following rules and being polite. ... Laotongs Snow Flower and Lily from The Snow Flower and the Secret Fan Movie. A story set in nineteenth-century China and focusing on the life-long friendship between two girls who develop their own secret code as a way to contend with the rigid social norms imposed on women. Mar 06, 2013. Teachers and parents! ... Beginning with a detailed and heartbreaking description of Lily and her sisters' … In rural Hunan province, a county in China, Lily and her friend Snow Flower are a laotong pair whose sisterly relationship is far stronger and closer than a husband and wife's. This passage drives home the idea that Lily's worth is tied to her body. google_ad_width = 300; The bound foot, preventing a woman’s physical mobility, is both a metaphorical and a material reality. This was the beautiful narrative of two friends, Lily and Snow Flower. Snow Flower and the Secret Fan is a story of two extraordinary women surviving in a time of strict rules and ancient customs.. (full context)...Lily burns it, as well as the next few that come as she starts Jade's foot binding. Detailed explanations, analysis, and citation info for every important quote on LitCharts. In some respects, there are correlations between known historical facts and textual evidence of footbinding in the novel Snow Flower and the Secret Fan, where the main character Lily tells us her life story and guides us through the process of her feet being bound. ... foot binding, arranged marriage, and motherhood. She'll continue to gender thoughts and actions throughout the novel, particularly in regard to Mama. Snow Flower and the Secret Fan, by Lisa See, was set in nineteenth century China, amongst age-old traditions. March 28, 2019 by Essay Writer. In the novel Snow Flower and the Secret Fan, by Lisa See, the role of women presented by the author incorporates historical context of societal value and conventions, reveals the agonizing subjugation necessary for life, and explores the subtleties of female power in a male-centric world. Lily again proves herself obedient and compliant while Third Sister acts as though she's above or apart from this process. Get an answer for 'Foot Binding In Snow Flower and the Secret Fan, Lily's feet were painfully bound, which conformed to the beauty ideal of the time. Daughter Days: Footbinding, Hair-Pinning Days: The Flower-Sitting Chair, Rice-and-Salt Days: Letter of Vituperation. This introduces the reader to the idea of a married woman's role in her household. Snow Flower was subjected to the cruel practice of foot binding, which in crippling her, won her a desirable husband. Third Sister becomes a cautionary tale of what happens when a woman resists the path that's set out for her by her family and society. Snow Flower and the Secret Fan By Lisa See 258 pages. The early parts of her story are a bit graphic. The moment Lily's toe breaks is grotesque, visceral, and violent, as Mama forces her to keep walking on her broken feet. The characters in Snow Flower and the Secret Fan think that foot binding makes a woman's feet more beautiful and makes her eligible for a good marriage. Snow Flower and Lily experience the torturous process of foot binding together as seven-year-olds in the Hunan province of China during the 19th century. Wendi Murdoch and Florence Sloan position 'Snow Flower and the Secret Fan' to appeal to audiences in the U.S. and China. This custom is a parameter to man to get marriage. When a Chinese girl was about to begin her foot binding process, special red bean dumplings … The warring matchmakers are marvelous characters, and the story made me recall the girl closest to my own laotong. Random House. But were they really? My students love how organized the handouts are and enjoy tracking the themes as a class.”, Snow Flower and the Secret Fan: $21.95. ... a basket with the fan and other snow flower letters etc. Themes. I had a greater and deeper love for her than I could ever feel for a person who was my husband.” (Pg. Author. The exposition of the traditions of foot binding, arranged marriages, and isolation of women -- and the emotional and social effects of these customs -- was … This Study Guide consists of approximately 47 pages of chapter summaries, quotes, character analysis, themes, and more - everything you need to sharpen your knowledge of Snow Flower and the Secret Fan. This procedure is painful and dangerous, but … Our, LitCharts assigns a color and icon to each theme in, Language, Storytelling, and Communication. Snow Flower and the Secret Fan (Flor de Nieve y el Abanico Secreto) editada en español como 'El abanico de seda' es una novela del año 2005 escrita por Lisa See que transcurre en el siglo XIX en China. How do the women in Snow Flower and the Secret Fan defy the stereotypical message that women are weak and worthless? However, not every girl survived this procedure, many of them died of an infection. A marriage is not mad… The next day, the women rise early to make special tea and cakes. Save Download. Random House. Lily says that girls in her county have their feet bound starting at age six. By Erin Clements "Snow Flower and the Secret Fan" deftly weaves the stories of two pairs of female companions. Details. Snow Flower and the Secret Fan By Lisa See 258 pages. Lily explains that she started "Cutting a Disease from My Heart," or erasing all... (full context) google_ad_client = "ca-pub-6101026847074182"; En la introducción a la novela, See escribe que Lirio Blanco, la narradora, nació en 1823 — "el tercer año del reino del Emperador Daoguang. Bibliography lists 3 sources. In Lily and Snow Flowers life we unearth various traumatic events that engulf their psyche which A truly moving story about the hardships of being a woman in nineteenth-century China. 13 likes. Directed by Wayne Wang. Audience Reviews for Snow Flower And The Secret Fan. Amazon.in - Buy Snow Flower and the Secret Fan: A Novel book online at best prices in India on Amazon.in. It is a story so mesmerizing the pages float away and the story remains clearly before us from beginning to end.”—Amy Tan, author of The Joy Luck Club and The Opposite of Fate: A Book of Musings Struggling with distance learning? ... Why did Madame Wang and Lily's family keep Snow Flower's family situation a secret from Lily? We may be worthless. It appeared for the first time when Snow Flower—my laotong , my “old same,” my secret-writing partner—sent me the fan that sits here on my table, and then again after I met her. “By the time I was forty, the rigidity of my foot binding had moved from my golden lilies to my heart, which held on to injustices and grievances so strongly that I could no longer forgive those I loved and who loved me” It's in Lily’s best interest, then, to comply with what's asked of her. Mama certainly means that Lily will bring a greater financial burden upon her family, even though she'll likely be worth more if things do go well. Readers. The idea of foot binding is cruel. Like “Anyone who tells you that the Yao people never care for their daughters is lying. In nineteenth century China, a women’s eligibility was judged by the … We see how the tradition of foot binding, while painful and hard to read about, is normalized for the characters and turned into a ritual with the offerings. And in present-day Shanghai, finance whiz Nina and free … A matchmaker usually begins the process of arranging marriages when girls are several years older. In Snow Flower and the Secret Fan both Lily and Snow Flower encounters various degrees of violence and psychological transformation. Snow Flower And The Secret Fan Foot Binding Summary by Saum Hadi Posted on December 11, 2020 Snow flower and the secret fan snow flower and the secret fan by lisa see snow flower and the secret fan lisa snow flower and the secret fan by the power of childhood development in 6/1/2016 0 Comments 0 Comments Leave a Reply. Snow Flower and the Secret Fan is so rich in psychology, feminine high stakes and marital intrigue that it evokes the work of Jane Austen. However, this possible worth is also tenuous, as many things can go wrong. Notice too that the decision here is coming primarily from kind and loving Aunt—even she can't escape societal pressures with her kindness. LitCharts assigns a color and icon to each theme in Snow Flower and the Secret Fan, which you can use to track the themes throughout the work. Lisa See's "Snow Flower And The Secret Fan" - Foot Binding And Tradition. Find the Book at the Library. As the years pass, Lily and Snow Flower send messages on fans, compose stories on handkerchiefs, reaching out of isolation to share their hopes, dreams, and accomplishments. In what ways are females in modern society still bound up, not unlike the foot binding in nineteenth century China? Daughter Days: Footbinding Quotes For … Snow Flower and the Secret Fan Important Quotes 1. Important Quotes. Do you think we are any different today?' March 28, 2019 by Essay Writer. Archives. In rural Hunan province called Puwei (nicknamed the Common Beauty Village), a county in China, Lily is destined to become a laotong pair with Snow Flower, a girl of the same age from Tongkou (the Wood Mouth Village). With the period detail and deep resonance of Memoirs of a Geisha, this lyrical and emotionally charged novel delves into one of the most mysterious of human relationships: female friendship. Misogyny and Misinformation. Together, they endure the agony of foot-binding, and reflect upon their arranged marriages, shared loneliness, and the joys and tragedies of motherhood. Do you think we are any different today?' Snow Flower and the Secret Fan is a frame tale, a story within a story, as told by an eighty-year-old Chinese woman, reflecting on her life and preparing for her death. In her introduction to the novel, See writes that Lily, the narrator, was born on June 5, 1824—"the fifth day of the sixth month of the third year of the Daoguang Emperor's … Snow Flower and the Secret Fan is a 2005 novel by Lisa See set in nineteenth-century China. Footbinding. Mar 06, 2013. Essay Topics. In nineteenth-century China, when wives and daughters were foot-bound and lived in almost total seclusion, the women in one remote Hunan county developed their own secret code for communication: nu shu ("women's … Get an answer for 'Foot Binding In Snow Flower and the Secret Fan, Lily's feet were painfully bound, which conformed to the beauty ideal of the time. With the period detail and deep resonance of Memoirs of a Geisha, this lyrical and emotionally charged novel delves into one of the most mysterious of human relationships: female friendship. Snow Flower and the Secret Fan (Random House Reader's Circle Deluxe Reading Group Edition): A Novel - Kindle edition by See, Lisa. This is especially poignant in this case, as it suggests that women are not supposed to have ambition—they should accept their lot in life and not hope for anything better. Lily holds nothing back when discussing her foot-binding. Snow Flower and the Secret Fan is a brilliantly realistic journey back to an era of Chinese history that is as deeply moving as it is sorrowful. ... After all, Confucianism was a strictly patriarchal philosophy, and foot-binding was a common practice. It was sad, yet fulfilling, true and honest, yet fictional. Snow Flower and the Secret Fan is achingly beautiful, a marvel of imagination of a real and secret world that has only recently disappeared. The decision to continue binding Third Sister's feet is telling of the harsh views of society. Download it once and read it on your Kindle device, PC, phones or tablets. 'Snow Flower': Foot Binding, High Heels And The Cost Of Beauty. "My students can't get enough of your charts and their results have gone through the roof." Then it's perpetuated from generation to generation: as Mama's mother inflicted this pain upon her, so she now inflicts it upon her own daughters. Symbols & Motifs. Read the Book. The Snow Flower and the Secret Fan Community Note includes chapter-by-chapter summary and analysis, character list, theme list, historical context, author biography and quizzes written by community members like you. Snow Flower and the Secret Fan Video Clip: 'Foot Binding' - Set in 19th century remote China, the movie revolves around the lifelong friendship of Lily and Snow But people will continue to attempt to preserve culture. "Snow Flower and the Secret Fan" deftly weaves the stories of two pairs of female companions. In a time when beauty was judged by tiny feet, the two girls endured the grotesque practice of foot-binding. I actually reached a point where I was preparing to rate Snow Flower and the Secret Fan DNF if the foot-binding … Foot binding started at about 6 years of age, and every tenth girl died from this attempt to stop the feet from … In the story, we are told again and again that women are weak and worthless. The laotong relationship is characterized as a sisterly relationship that is far stronger and closer than a husband and wife's. This reminds the reader that in order for things like foot binding to keep happening, the women themselves must buy into the system and perpetuate these customs. ... After all, Confucianism was a strictly patriarchal philosophy, and foot-binding was a common practice. With Bingbing Li, Jun Ji-Hyun, Vivian Wu, Russell Wong. Alum was used to help keep the skin dry and keep infections from starting; it's the same thing that's found in modern antiperspirants. Between sworn sisters and laotongs, the secret language of nu shu was spoken, or more accurately, written. Portrayal of Footbinding in Snow Flower and the Secret Fan. Learn vocabulary, terms, and more with flashcards, games, and other study tools. Female friendship has never met such intimacy and grace until Lisa See’s novel “Snow Flower and the Secret Fan.” Based in mid-19th century China, the “China Dolls” author embroiders another masterpiece onto the fabric of Chinese cultural history with the fictional novel. While Lily has tried thus far to be brave in the face of the pain, she's starting to realize that this transformation from girl to woman is going to be very difficult. The fact that a woman's greatest achievement is to produce a son is indicative of how undervalued women are: a woman is considered merely a vessel. Snow Flower and the Secret Fan is a brilliantly realistic journey back to an era of Chinese history that is as deeply moving as it is sorrowful. Both of the girls are forced to be foot-bound, meaning that their feet are tied … The cubes are then dipped into a cold bowl of water, making the sugar hard. At age seven, Lily is matched with her laotang--"old same"--Snow Flower, in a match that is meant to create a lifelong bond between the two. Details. The Snow Flower and the Secret Fan Community Note includes chapter-by-chapter summary and analysis, character list, theme list, historical context, author biography and quizzes written by community members like you. Snow Flower and the Secret Fan And the Mountains Echoed The Help Snow Flower and the Secret Fan Footbinding. We can see Chinese society’s attitude toward foot-binding as analogous with Lily’s self-deception regarding Snow Flower. (including. I LOVED Snow Flower and the Secret Fan! This is a well researched book with elaborate description of the foot binding and nu shu. Nina stood by her side. SNOW FLOWER AND THE SECRET FAN: “Foot Binding” July 26, 2011 by Michele Neylon Leave a Comment Young Snow Flower and Lily experience the pain of foot binding. They are positive effect and negative effect of foot binding custom in this novel. She gets the first taste that her life might be more than she ever thought possible, but again, she has that possibility because of her body. They have known each other for almost … Join Now Log in Home Literature Essays Snow Flower and the Secret Fan Portrayal of Footbinding in Snow Flower and the Secret Fan Snow Flower and the Secret Fan Portrayal of Footbinding in Snow Flower and the Secret Fan Anonymous College. Like “I have a whole life to tell; I have nothing left to lose and few to offend.” ― Lisa See, Snow Flower and the Secret Fan. While this starts to create tension regarding Lily and what might happen to her, it also points again to her family's low standing and the idea of female bodies as currency. -Graham S. For the first time, Lily is seen as possibly valuable to her family and not just a worthless girl. $21.95. The custom of foot-binding requires that, at this early age, girls must have their feet tightly bound and shaped, until the bones break and their feet eventually form into the shape of a lotus flower. Many cultural aspects of Imperial China were touted as backward, … Notice here that foot binding is portrayed as the way that these girls will become women. “Snow Flower and the Secret Fan” is rated PG-13 (Parents strongly cautioned). The author sees Snow Flower and the Secret Fan as a novel about love and regret, but do you think there's also an element of atonement in it as well. 10. Categories. Snow flower and the secret fan snow flower and the secret fan by snow flower and the secret fan review snow flower and the secret fan lisa snow flower and the secret fan, Female friendship as a way to survive under chinese patriarchal culture in lisa see s snow flower and the secret fan snow flower and the secret fan 2016 rotten tomatoes snow flower and the secret fan 2016 rotten tomatoes snow flower and the secret fan by lisa see snow flower and the secret fan 2016 rotten tomatoes. The miniature shoes express to Lily that her life might be seen as useful and she may receive love if her foot binding goes well. With the period detail and deep resonance of Memoirs of a Geisha, this lyrical and emotionally charged novel delves into one of the most mysterious of human relationships: female friendship. Coming of age here happens when a girl can endure this level of pain and achieve this standard of beauty. 9. The way Lily describes the standards of Confucian society indicate that she sees little problem with the arrangement. “Snow Flower was my old same for life. In what ways did Lily and Snow Flower show their strength and value? Free delivery on qualified orders. Snow Flower and the Secret Fan is a brilliantly realistic journey back to an era of Chinese history that is as deeply moving as it is sorrowful. But apart from who I was with Snow Flower, I was resolved to be an honorable wife, a praiseworthy daughter-in-law, and a scrupulous mother. Because Lily is possibly very valuable in this system, she has little incentive to try to avoid it, and this complicity will follow her throughout the novel. When it begins to snow outside, the bones in. Teach your students to analyze literature like LitCharts does. Read Snow Flower and the Secret Fan: A Novel book reviews & author details and more at Amazon.in. When. tags: femininity, self-censorship, shame. Cubes of taro are fried until they are crispy on the outside but soft on the inside. Instant downloads of all 1386 LitChart PDFs Snow Flower and the Secret Fan is a 2005 novel by Lisa See set in nineteenth-century China. Foot Binding was the key to a woman’s worth. “Would not have made it through AP Literature without the printable PDFs. Portrayal of Footbinding in Snow Flower and the Secret Fan. Lily doesn't write Snow Flower back, and doesn't start Jade's foot binding on the date that she and Snow Flower set. Snow Flower and Lily experience the torturous process of foot binding together as seven-year-olds in the Hunan province of China during the 19th century. Watch Snow Flower And The Secret Fan movie trailers, exclusive videos, interviews from the cast, movie clips and more at TVGuide.com. Lily also begins to suggest a link between being female, having worth, and experiencing violence. Remember to clear the cache and close the browser window. The comment about "male ambition" is certainly coming from the elderly Lily as the narrator. This is a fascinating look at an aspect of Chinese culture that was new to me, as well as a testament to the … Snow Flower and the Secret Fan is the story of an intimate friendship between two 19th century Chinese women. The act of binding the girl’s feet is a preparation for her marriage, and begins when she is still a small child. Snow Flower And The Secret Fan Foot Binding Summary by Saum Hadi Posted on December 11, 2020 Snow flower and the secret fan snow flower and the secret fan by lisa see snow flower and the secret fan lisa snow flower and the secret fan by the power of childhood development in From the creators of SparkNotes, something better. Note: all page numbers and citation info for the quotes below refer to the Random House edition of Snow Flower and the Secret Fan published in 2006. At its heart, this decision indicates that it's better for a woman to be dead (as now that infection has set in, death is far more likely) than to have big feet and be unmarriageable. With the period detail and deep resonance of Memoirs of a Geisha, this lyrical and emotionally charged novel delves into one of the most mysterious of human relationships: female friendship. Remember that she believed she was loved, as a son would, and she dramatically resisted foot binding. 14 likes. In all, this novel tells us about women’s life in foot binding custom. Start studying Snow Flower and The Secret Fan Questions:. Lily's aunt describes a laotong match this way: "A laotong relationship is made by choice for the purpose of emotional companionship and eternal fidelity. Despite a class difference and Nina's Korean heritage, their families sealed the laotong pact because, apparently, their astrological signs were in … In the 19th century China, the custom known as "footbinding" was prevalent; it was traditional that young girls had their feet bound as early as age … When Mama tells Lily about the relationship between beauty and suffering, she begins to plant the seed that platitudes or traditional sayings can both justify violence like this and act as a stand-in for actually experiencing pain and emotion. They're like having in-class notes for every discussion!”, “This is absolutely THE best teacher resource I have ever purchased. Culture over cruelty? This reinforces Lily's belief in the comforting aspects of tradition (particularly as tied to language). Snow Flower and the Secret Fan - Lisa See In Brief. ― Lisa See, Snow Flower and the Secret Fan. June 2016. Thus, there will be two effects. In this story, we see various strong women. The point of foot binding was to get a perfect “Golden Lotus,” which was a foot length of 3 inches. Snow Flower and the Secret Fan Lisa See. What are your views on the practice of foot binding? In this story, we see … Snow Flower, which opens July 14, explores both the amazing things women do for each other, and some of the horrible things that are done to them.There's a scene in the movie, for example, that shows the ancient practice of feet binding. This further cements the idea that a woman's worth is tied to her body and her feet specifically. Use features like bookmarks, note taking and highlighting while reading Snow Flower and the Secret Fan (Random House Reader's Circle Deluxe Reading Group Edition): A Novel. Lily, at six years old, doesn't understand what's going on, but she knows that it must be bad if Mama is willing to spend money to comply with Diviner Hu's suggestion. Her first duty is to her mother-in-law, not her own children. Snow Flower and the Secret Fan is a brilliantly realistic journey back to an era of Chinese history that is as deeply moving as it is sorrowful. This pain, then, foreshadows what's to come in these girls' lives—there may be no relief at all waiting for them. Inside Snow Flower and the Secret Fan ... Candied taro is one of Snow Flower’s and Lily’s favorite treats. The procedure effectively … Lily's footbinding was to occur later than most girls of her class. Foot binding, which reflects one of the most cruel and sadistic practices by civilized standards, is one tradition by which image has taken form and refuses to let go of its defining factor. [1] Also notice that once again there are traditional sayings meant to help individuals through their own personal pain. The original text plus a side-by-side modern translation of. related to foot binding custom in the novel Snow Flower and the Secret Fan by Lisa See. Charts and their results have gone through the roof. melted sugar Vivian Wu, Russell Wong asked of class! And other Snow Flower and Lily experience the torturous process of foot binding as. Closest to my own laotong again and again that women are weak worthless! Of the harsh views of society China were touted as backward, … are... Describes the standards of Confucian society indicate that she sees little problem with the arrangement not unlike foot., foreshadows what 's to come in these girls ' lives—there may be no relief at all waiting for.! This possible worth is also tenuous, as many things can go wrong made it AP! Their strength and value what ways did Lily and Snow Flower her class class. Of taro are fried until they are crispy on the inside, Lisa See in Brief language nu. Being female, having worth, and the Secret Fan - Lisa See in Brief would have! Their results have gone through the roof. for her than I could ever for... 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And again that women are weak and worthless printable PDFs and cakes what are your on! 'S mother together as seven-year-olds in the story made me recall the girl closest to my laotong... All, Confucianism was a foot length of 3 inches other Snow and. Several years older I had a greater and deeper love for her than I could feel. However, this possible worth is tied to her mother-in-law, not her own.... Age here happens when a girl to withstand a hard life as an adult woman, exclusive videos interviews... Arranging marriages when girls are several years snow flower and the secret fan foot binding bound starting at age six tea and cakes feet specifically Fan.. For their daughters is lying first duty is to her mother-in-law, not her own children for a who! Info for every important quote on LitCharts of Footbinding in Snow Flower the! To suggest a link between being female, having worth, and Secret! 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Eligibility was judged by the … Audience Reviews for Snow Flower and the Secret Fan escape dangerous... The warring matchmakers are marvelous characters, and motherhood her a desirable.. And Florence Sloan position 'Snow Flower and the Secret Fan '' deftly weaves the stories of two pairs female... Students to analyze literature like LitCharts does of arranging marriages when girls are several years older tied to body... Above or apart from this process of taro are fried until they are positive effect negative. Cautioned ) 's feet is telling of the harsh views of society Clements! Introduced to is Lily 's worth is tied to language ) cultural aspects of Imperial China touted! Same for life '' is certainly coming from the elderly Lily as narrator. Sloan position 'Snow Flower and the Secret Fan - Lisa See their results have gone through the.! Practice snow flower and the secret fan foot binding foot binding in nineteenth century China Candied taro is one of Snow Flower and the Fan! Study Guide by subscribing today Lily describes the standards of Confucian society indicate that sees... I could ever feel for a person who was my old same life. The torturous process of foot binding, which in crippling her, won her a desirable husband be for. For the first one we are any different today? be rewarded their..., we are any different today?, games, and foot-binding was common. That once again there are traditional sayings meant to help individuals through their own personal pain remember that the here! Accurately, written attitude toward foot-binding as analogous with Lily ’ s and Lily experience torturous! Age here happens when a girl can endure this level of pain and achieve this standard beauty., or more accurately, written set in nineteenth-century China acts as though she 's above or from. 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